Sounds Like Once Saved Always Saved?
Question: So it sounds like "Once saved always saved." You said,"I believe that a saved person cannot get unsaved". The Bible doesn't speak about it at all? Can you give me a verse? Yes I can!!!!!!
Ezekiel 18:24
24"But when a righteous man turns away from his righteousness, commits iniquity and does according to all the abominations that a wicked man does, will he live? All his righteous deeds which he has done will not be remembered for his treachery which he has committed and his sin which he has committed; for them he will die.
2 Peter 2:20-22
20.If indeed they have escaped the corruption of the world through their knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, only to be entangled and overcome by it again, their final
condition is worse than it was at first. 21.It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness than to have known it and turned away from the holy commandment passed on to them. 22.Of them the proverbs are true: “A dog returns to its vomit,” and, “A sow that is washed goes back to her wallowing in the mud.”
Luke 9:61-62
61. Still another said, “I will follow You, Lord; but first let me bid farewell to my family.” 62.Then Jesus declared, “No one who puts his hand to the plow and then looks back is fit for the kingdom of God.”
Have a blessed day!
Answer: Greetings to you in Jesus wonderful name! First of all the permanence of salvation which we can call as once saved always saved (OSAS) is something that gives hope to all believers that God is faithful (1 Cor 1:9), mercy triumphs over judgment (Jam 2:13), salvation is eternal (Heb 5:9), Christ never throws away even the least among those who believe and come to Him, and instead He promises protection for eternity ahead (John 10:27-30), the Scripture promises that no one can separate us from the love of God and that includes even us who were saved by the love of Jesus which is in Him (Rom 8:35, 38-39), not one time the apostles or any other writer of the Scripture had ever told or expressed that the sealing of the Holy Spirit that happens during the time of salvation as a guarantee from God that he/she will rise up in the day of rapture has ever been given a exception for the unsealing to happen in any particular circumstance or the promise given with a condition so that those who fail the condition be unsealed of the Holy Spirit (Eph 1:13-14; 2 Cor 1:21-22). And the only condition given for salvation is to believe in Jesus, and that qualifies any humans to receive the promise of salvation that the Father gives, thus receiving eternal life of which Jesus affirmed that all those have kept the will of the Heavenly Father, He will never lose anybody who has believed, Jesus has promised to raise him/her in the last day (John 6:39-40). All those who see Jesus and believe him will rest within his heart instead of working and striving out by keeping the law or being religious to keep the tradition to please God (Heb 4:3, 9-10). The most clear cut verse that Jesus Himself pronounced regarding OSAS is seen in John 10:27-30, "27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. 28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand. 30 I and My Father are one.”". In other words, When Jesus gives eternal life, the saved will never ever perish, neither shall anyone like Satan, demons or even ourselves shall be able to snatch the salvation out of Jesus' hand. Our Father who resides in Heaven who is the greatest of all, no one will be able to snatch out of His hand. Praise the Lord!
Having said the above, I want you to learn Scripture by the context, rather by picking up one verse here and one verse there to justify what you say. Anything you say off context cannot justify your doctrine.
Ezekiel 18:24, is a Old Testament verse, and we know that all those has been conditionally given as a test to the Israelites is a shadow (Col 2:17), of which the substance is Christ in whom the believer through faith is able to say a loud 'Yes' and 'Amen' to all the Old Testament Scriptures because it has all been fulfilled in Him (2 Cor 1:20; Matt 5:17-20). In other words, because Christ has taken all the curse of the Old Testament law upon Himself on behalf of us (Gal 3:13), now we as just in God sight in Christ Jesus can continue to believe the promises of God in the Scripture with faith without incurring the curses for not continuing in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them (Gal 3:10, 11). But as a believer we will return back to faith without giving up, so that the blessing of Abraham which is the promise of the Spirit we might receive in Christ Jesus (Heb 10:38-39; Gal 3:14). So this above verse first of all doesn't disprove OSAS.
Coming to 2 Peter 2:20-22, here the context is spoken regarding false teachers who were not saved at all, though these men or women have come to hear about Jesus and have "knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ", they did not allow the Lord to penetrate their heart with His Word and make it become fruitful, and so this was more of a head knowledge they had rather than the heart knowledge which saves them eternally (Matt 7:21-23; 13:20-21; Rom 10:9-10). When someone does a confession, it does not mean that they are saved the same moment (Matt 7:22; 1 Cor 15:1-2; 16:13), Paul has told them to check whether their nature has changed within them because of their faith which is true salvation (2 Cor 13:5-6; Rom 8:16). So only the old nature was within them and the new nature of Jesus never appeared in them as they were not saved at all (Rom 8:9), so for this reason apostle Peter compares them to a Dog and a Sow which are all unclean animals (2 Peter 2:22; Php 3:2). The dog returns to eat its own vomit which means the one who professed that he was saved from sin, goes back in to sin to live in it and practice lawlessness, just like a pig when given a chance to eat the human excrement and all kind of unclean thing, chooses to live in the mire of gutter even when it is formerly taken out of it and given a external bath by a owner. Why this happens? Because the internal nature of neither a dog, nor a pig ever gets changed. Once given a chance to do its own thing, it returns to the unclean nature which works within it forever and ever. A unsaved person will always choose to return to sin when given a chance to live by themselves alone with no others around them. But a believer cannot continue to live in sin without chastisement and conviction from the Lord which brings repentance unto life more often than not (Heb 11:6; John 16:7-11; Acts 11:18; 2 Cor 7:10; 1 John 3:6, 8-9; Heb 10:39). So from this clear exposition from the context of the passage of the above verse, we know that this truth does not oppose or disprove OSAS. Instead it only reaffirms it.
Coming finally to the passage of Luke 9:61-62, which you referred to disprove OSAS doctrine, is actually a passage that shows the invitation from Jesus to this particular fellow who have believed him already, to walk in the higher call of being a disciple of Jesus which needs more sacrifice and nearly everything we are and have, to be and become one (Matt 10:37-39). This fellow felt that the cost of discipleship was too high, and therefore did not follow Jesus as His disciple. In other words, even during the three and half year ministry of Jesus on earth, many believed Him and were saved (John 1:12; 12:42; 9:22; 7:12-13; 7:31; 10:42; 11:45; 8:30; Acts 15:5), yet only those who abide in the Words of Jesus to obey Him and sacrifice themselves and their time, talent and money completely can only become His disciple as Jesus Himself told (John 8:31; Luke 14:26-27, 33). For those disciples, the cost to become one consumes their whole life, but the reward of God infinitely outweighs the cost they have paid to become a disciple (Matt 19:27-30; Mark 10:29-30; Luke 18:28, 29-30; 22:28-30). So we know that a person can be a believer and yet not a disciple of Jesus because of the high cost of discipleship, but a believer can be a believer without paying any cost for it, because Jesus has paid the cost to save them from sin and hell fire, but the eternal reward for non-disciples are pitiable and regrettable (John 19:30; Matt 10:32; Luke 12:8; 1 Cor 6:20; Gal 3:13-14). Even this above final verse you have given to prove wrong the doctrine of OSAS or the permanence of salvation of a believer is proved to be wrong.
So all the verses you gave to prove against OSAS (i.e.) Once Saved Always Saved doctrine, are taken completely out of context and believed wrongly. So I again reaffirm my statement, I believe that a saved person cannot get unsaved. And then ask the same question you have asked me, back to you. Can you give me a verse to prove OSAS as wrong?
Much Blessings....
Ezekiel 18:24
24"But when a righteous man turns away from his righteousness, commits iniquity and does according to all the abominations that a wicked man does, will he live? All his righteous deeds which he has done will not be remembered for his treachery which he has committed and his sin which he has committed; for them he will die.
2 Peter 2:20-22
20.If indeed they have escaped the corruption of the world through their knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, only to be entangled and overcome by it again, their final
condition is worse than it was at first. 21.It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness than to have known it and turned away from the holy commandment passed on to them. 22.Of them the proverbs are true: “A dog returns to its vomit,” and, “A sow that is washed goes back to her wallowing in the mud.”
Luke 9:61-62
61. Still another said, “I will follow You, Lord; but first let me bid farewell to my family.” 62.Then Jesus declared, “No one who puts his hand to the plow and then looks back is fit for the kingdom of God.”
Have a blessed day!
Answer: Greetings to you in Jesus wonderful name! First of all the permanence of salvation which we can call as once saved always saved (OSAS) is something that gives hope to all believers that God is faithful (1 Cor 1:9), mercy triumphs over judgment (Jam 2:13), salvation is eternal (Heb 5:9), Christ never throws away even the least among those who believe and come to Him, and instead He promises protection for eternity ahead (John 10:27-30), the Scripture promises that no one can separate us from the love of God and that includes even us who were saved by the love of Jesus which is in Him (Rom 8:35, 38-39), not one time the apostles or any other writer of the Scripture had ever told or expressed that the sealing of the Holy Spirit that happens during the time of salvation as a guarantee from God that he/she will rise up in the day of rapture has ever been given a exception for the unsealing to happen in any particular circumstance or the promise given with a condition so that those who fail the condition be unsealed of the Holy Spirit (Eph 1:13-14; 2 Cor 1:21-22). And the only condition given for salvation is to believe in Jesus, and that qualifies any humans to receive the promise of salvation that the Father gives, thus receiving eternal life of which Jesus affirmed that all those have kept the will of the Heavenly Father, He will never lose anybody who has believed, Jesus has promised to raise him/her in the last day (John 6:39-40). All those who see Jesus and believe him will rest within his heart instead of working and striving out by keeping the law or being religious to keep the tradition to please God (Heb 4:3, 9-10). The most clear cut verse that Jesus Himself pronounced regarding OSAS is seen in John 10:27-30, "27 My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. 28 And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of My Father’s hand. 30 I and My Father are one.”". In other words, When Jesus gives eternal life, the saved will never ever perish, neither shall anyone like Satan, demons or even ourselves shall be able to snatch the salvation out of Jesus' hand. Our Father who resides in Heaven who is the greatest of all, no one will be able to snatch out of His hand. Praise the Lord!
Having said the above, I want you to learn Scripture by the context, rather by picking up one verse here and one verse there to justify what you say. Anything you say off context cannot justify your doctrine.
Ezekiel 18:24, is a Old Testament verse, and we know that all those has been conditionally given as a test to the Israelites is a shadow (Col 2:17), of which the substance is Christ in whom the believer through faith is able to say a loud 'Yes' and 'Amen' to all the Old Testament Scriptures because it has all been fulfilled in Him (2 Cor 1:20; Matt 5:17-20). In other words, because Christ has taken all the curse of the Old Testament law upon Himself on behalf of us (Gal 3:13), now we as just in God sight in Christ Jesus can continue to believe the promises of God in the Scripture with faith without incurring the curses for not continuing in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them (Gal 3:10, 11). But as a believer we will return back to faith without giving up, so that the blessing of Abraham which is the promise of the Spirit we might receive in Christ Jesus (Heb 10:38-39; Gal 3:14). So this above verse first of all doesn't disprove OSAS.
Coming to 2 Peter 2:20-22, here the context is spoken regarding false teachers who were not saved at all, though these men or women have come to hear about Jesus and have "knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ", they did not allow the Lord to penetrate their heart with His Word and make it become fruitful, and so this was more of a head knowledge they had rather than the heart knowledge which saves them eternally (Matt 7:21-23; 13:20-21; Rom 10:9-10). When someone does a confession, it does not mean that they are saved the same moment (Matt 7:22; 1 Cor 15:1-2; 16:13), Paul has told them to check whether their nature has changed within them because of their faith which is true salvation (2 Cor 13:5-6; Rom 8:16). So only the old nature was within them and the new nature of Jesus never appeared in them as they were not saved at all (Rom 8:9), so for this reason apostle Peter compares them to a Dog and a Sow which are all unclean animals (2 Peter 2:22; Php 3:2). The dog returns to eat its own vomit which means the one who professed that he was saved from sin, goes back in to sin to live in it and practice lawlessness, just like a pig when given a chance to eat the human excrement and all kind of unclean thing, chooses to live in the mire of gutter even when it is formerly taken out of it and given a external bath by a owner. Why this happens? Because the internal nature of neither a dog, nor a pig ever gets changed. Once given a chance to do its own thing, it returns to the unclean nature which works within it forever and ever. A unsaved person will always choose to return to sin when given a chance to live by themselves alone with no others around them. But a believer cannot continue to live in sin without chastisement and conviction from the Lord which brings repentance unto life more often than not (Heb 11:6; John 16:7-11; Acts 11:18; 2 Cor 7:10; 1 John 3:6, 8-9; Heb 10:39). So from this clear exposition from the context of the passage of the above verse, we know that this truth does not oppose or disprove OSAS. Instead it only reaffirms it.
Coming finally to the passage of Luke 9:61-62, which you referred to disprove OSAS doctrine, is actually a passage that shows the invitation from Jesus to this particular fellow who have believed him already, to walk in the higher call of being a disciple of Jesus which needs more sacrifice and nearly everything we are and have, to be and become one (Matt 10:37-39). This fellow felt that the cost of discipleship was too high, and therefore did not follow Jesus as His disciple. In other words, even during the three and half year ministry of Jesus on earth, many believed Him and were saved (John 1:12; 12:42; 9:22; 7:12-13; 7:31; 10:42; 11:45; 8:30; Acts 15:5), yet only those who abide in the Words of Jesus to obey Him and sacrifice themselves and their time, talent and money completely can only become His disciple as Jesus Himself told (John 8:31; Luke 14:26-27, 33). For those disciples, the cost to become one consumes their whole life, but the reward of God infinitely outweighs the cost they have paid to become a disciple (Matt 19:27-30; Mark 10:29-30; Luke 18:28, 29-30; 22:28-30). So we know that a person can be a believer and yet not a disciple of Jesus because of the high cost of discipleship, but a believer can be a believer without paying any cost for it, because Jesus has paid the cost to save them from sin and hell fire, but the eternal reward for non-disciples are pitiable and regrettable (John 19:30; Matt 10:32; Luke 12:8; 1 Cor 6:20; Gal 3:13-14). Even this above final verse you have given to prove wrong the doctrine of OSAS or the permanence of salvation of a believer is proved to be wrong.
So all the verses you gave to prove against OSAS (i.e.) Once Saved Always Saved doctrine, are taken completely out of context and believed wrongly. So I again reaffirm my statement, I believe that a saved person cannot get unsaved. And then ask the same question you have asked me, back to you. Can you give me a verse to prove OSAS as wrong?
Much Blessings....
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